The “community center” needs a new name - Page 2
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Thread: The “community center” needs a new name

  1. #11
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    Feb 2007
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    Default Business Community Center

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbear View Post
    I agree Kim. Its not just Jack. However when he has finger in every pie its not easy to ignore the stained hands. I understand your realtor position as well. For me it's not just these individuals jobs it is the history of the investments and track record of their leadership endeavours.
    All in all I believe we are on the same page. This is not a community center. It's a profit plan wanting to ride off the taxpayers investment in the property to line the pockets of a few.
    Kim, I never gave hi-jack all the credit, simply stated I have never and will never support "community projects" with that particular benefiary. There is no doubt that a banquet hall and overflow parking are a wonderful thing. I am still waiting for the overhead pedestrian bridge. Meanwhile, this tax payer funded commercial program has yet to host a basketball game in what was the only building not to be asbestos condemned. Hi-jack is just a very bad front person for a very bad band.... does anyone remember the questions to Carr about the future of the old school as he toured and touted with hi-jacks pom-poms? Now we have the answer. Bought and paid for property tax and rah-rah boosterism. To everyone, how much have you paid, how much have you benefited?

    BTW.... where are the flowing ecological karst pools, community hiking trails, high paying jobs, artist community housing (I believe that slid onto Grand Ave. at community expense without the houses) that were to come with the approved zoning changes and condos? I mean, fool me once is long gone.

    Kim, I also appreciate the many small businesses, including yours that have given many local teens the opportunity to work and learn work. This ain't that. The new school is one story, the old another. In neither do I see the tax payers that funded both winning.
    Last edited by akerue; 12-29-2017 at 10:28 PM.
    "They tried to bury us, but did not know we were seeds." Mexican proverb

  2. #12
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    Mar 2012
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    "Now on to the other points. Didn't the taxpayers just build a $13,000,000.00 school? A school that according to survey and attendance projections will be under utilized and at less than 70% occupancy in as little as 6 years. Sounds like there will be ample room for activities and after school activities in a $13,000,00.00 building we have already purchased and are already heating, cooling and insuring?*"

    Barbear you might add repairing, to that as well.

    Wow! I was all excited about this idea, and haven't kept up with the changes to the plan. Eurekans drive to B'ville to use the community pool. I thought this would be that and more. How disappointing! Bait & switch...
    "I'll tell you this...No eternal reward will forgive us now For wasting the dawn." Jim Morrison

  3. #13
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    Jan 1999
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    Eureka Springs, Ar, USA
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    The Berryville Community Center has a stable designated tax that helps support it. Even with the tax, it was still a difficult project to get up and running and keep it running.

  4. #14
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    Mar 2005
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    Listen, everyone! If someone gave me a gold bar I would quietly carry it away.

  5. #15
    Kim Yonkee's Avatar
    Kim Yonkee is offline Ward? Don't you think you were a little bit hard on the Beaver?
    Join Date
    May 1998
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    Just beyond the edge of Eureky
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    Typical outsider telling us what to do. If somebody gives us a gold bar we complain about the weight, by gum. Surely you’ve been around long enough to hear that 1,437,862 times.

    I understand that it’s expensive to run a community center—even with a dedicated tax. If people with the very best of intentions get deeper into a project and discover, whoa, there’s really no way to make this work without turning most of the property into commercial rentals, that’s understandable. But if that’s the case, it should be said.

    People will complain and that’s not just because they’re business-hating Eurekans who would get a gold bar and...y’all know the drill. Part of the pitch when we voted to build the multi-million dollar new school was that the old property would be sold with proceeds used to pay down the debt. That didn’t happen, which is not entirely suspect. Big properties sit on the market here for years. Said it before, say it again: there are not a lot of options that wouldn’t be better than leaving an enormous property to rot in the middle of town.

    It’s just...this looks like yet another project that is entering the traditional Eureka disappointment and resentment doom loop. Everything that has ever ticked people off in the past is back—from the taxpayer funded property prep and special terms for a private group to the famously weird and epically bankrupt treasurer (seriously? There was no other job available?) to the city, the chamber, the school board, the banks. Even terms like the “Big Six,” which is a very old designation that hasn’t been true since one former Big went bankrupt and left town and another went, more or less, out of business. At least two, if not four, of the former “Big Six” would have no (businesslike) reason to back a mold-remediated, old gym competitor to their own meeting and convention business.

    This is getting to the point where it makes no sense—always fertile ground for suspicion and resentment. Somebody is going to bring up the $45,000 Latimer Christmas light debacle or Save the Aud or the sewer plant or any number of previous Eureka doom loop projects any minute here and they won’t be entirely off base.

    There is no way to avoid people complaining about a lack of services for citizens. If there is some other small town in America with a soccer field 4 miles outside of town, an in town softball field that’s locked up to keep people from using it, no community meeting place, no senior services, no recreation program, I guarantee you those people are complaining too. But telling people, “We’re doing this commercial development project for YOU,” has never worked and it never will.

  6. #16
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    Feb 2007
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    Actually Kim, they never did say it would be sold to pay down the new school, that was suggested by citizen(s) but they did not promise that because they couldn't/wouldn't appraise it's value. After selling the notion that the old school (which all of our kids spent their days in) was an immediate hazard and deathtrap that might cost more to remove than use it became an even harder sell. The sale, community center, farmer's market, art center, gym, senior services in the abundant space within the gym building were all dangled as part of the sell of building the new school.

    Which is another story. Built in a hole with serious drainage, leaking and structural issues. The gym floor has been re-done once already and will have to be replaced sooner than later and perhaps, judging from cracks from the floor up on both ends of the gym point to foundation issues at the low end of the pit it was built in.

    When they did the sales show, Wayne artfully dodged substantive questions about schools, new and old, traffic, location etc and focused on the imminent deaths of our children and anyone being against any aspects of the new school as child haters. The current problem will not be the last of the entirely ill-conceived, boosterized, poorly planned project. It's a gold brick around the necks of the people in the pool that was never built.
    "They tried to bury us, but did not know we were seeds." Mexican proverb

  7. #17
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    May 2006
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    Muskogee, Oklahoma, USA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southwindcome View Post
    Listen, everyone! If someone gave me a gold bar I would quietly carry it away.
    Key word here being "quietly". Ron would not ride off into the sunset, with that gold bar, on a loud motorcycle,,,ever.
    ;-)

    Now for some comments from another "outsider", an Okie From Muskogee. Still at the Western edge of the Ozarks, but an outsider never the less.
    Just to put things in perspective, Eureka, again is not all that unique. Take my community for example.

    We have a bed tax too. Are people fighting over it? It's a million bucks! You bet your butt they are. The candidate running for mayor's (against his ex- father in law) biggest campaign strategy so far is to petition the city to dedicate 45% of the "tourist tax" to give city employees (uniformed and non-uniformed) a raise. According to him, tourism does nothing for the economy. He's trying to buy a block of votes.

    Our "good old boy/girl" network is (take your pick) the city council, the Chamber of Commerce, the City of Muskogee Foundation, Tourism (still connected to the Chamber), ODOT, the Muskogee Hotel & Lodging Association, etc. None of these people are really evil, some are just not real bright.

    Public facilities in need of funding; yes, we got em. The Civic Center (Auditorium) is about a $300,000 plus cost each year, the Historic Roxy Theatre cost is probably another $50,000 - $75,000. The Three Rivers Museum, The Batfish (submarine) Museum, the Oklahoma Music Hall of Fame & Museum are all struggling to find "sustainability". Then there's Hat Box Field, an old airport, now festival/fairgrounds/expo center/multi purpose sports complex - costs unknown. The new MLK Community Center just cost a couple of million to build & we don't know how much it will cost to operate. And finally, we just finished a $6,000,000 new Muskogee Little Theater building project, that started out as $5 million project and guess what,,,have no idea how to pay for the ongoing expenses connected to it either.

    My message is; if misery loves company, Muskogee & Eureka Springs should be happy campers.

    Sent from my Dick Tracy, two-way, wrist radio.
    "Ride On"

  8. #18
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    May 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southwindcome View Post
    Listen, everyone! If someone gave me a gold bar I would quietly carry it away.
    i dont know but ive been told,
    its hard to run with the weight of gold.
    other times ive heard it said,
    tis just as hard with the weight of lead

  9. #19
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    Apr 2007
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    Overall, this idea of moving is half-baked. If the City needs a new home, then usually it's a multi step process:
    define the need, short and long term.
    prepare and approve a request for proposal through council and mayor.
    publish proposal and seek bids equally. (we only know what the non-profit, privately held corp is offering.)
    open, discuss and choose the best option for our city, or reject them all.

    Thank you Kim and Bear and so many others that feel the same way. We are better than this.

    How much back rent are we getting from Dr. Beard? Could you imagine not paying him for 20 plus years?

    Happy New Year all.
    pat

  10. #20
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    What were the arrangements in the deed for Dr. Beard, when the property was deeded to the city in 1959?
    Last edited by irondragon; 12-31-2017 at 12:34 PM.
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