Jeff Jeans... - Page 3
Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 43

Thread: Jeff Jeans...

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    7,606

    Default

    Terri, I never assumed that you are rich but "Obamacare" never prevented or outlawed people making more money. You are posting on a public board, lambasting a program due to your personal situation and then complaining that they don't know your personal situation. But... we should take your criticism seriously.

    Obviously, you don't like paying for insurance, even with a subsidy. You should have a more in depth conversation with Jeff. There is a reason this former libertarian, anti- most all government programs is headed to D.C. to protect the A.C.A. . Ask him. Almost all of us have worked and paid out payroll taxes for Social Security all our lives and our employers, if we have them, have been matching that money. Would you be so mad if the Medicare lifeline were not so close? Yes it's a fact of life... if you are receiving public aid of any kind, whether it was earned in the past or not, it will be reduced, cut altogether or your additional incomes taxed or penalized if they exceed certain thresholds. It is any recipients responsibility to know what those thresholds are. Obama didn't prevent you from working or earning, you decided it wasn't worth working more and paying more for your insurance on the same income/benefit table we all have to deal with.

    If everybody followed your model and said oh well, I feel pretty good and I'm going to save that dang insurance money ( and yes it's a struggle for most of us and at the least a major expense), and if the health crap hits the fan, I will apply for financial aid, you would be S.O.L. because the financial aid well would be bone dry.
    "They tried to bury us, but did not know we were seeds." Mexican proverb

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    153

    Default

    Nothing you say makes any sense to me.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    7,606

    Default

    I am sorry Terri. I want for you what I wish for everyone. Good health and in the event that it fails you, may there be the best possible health care available regardless of your station in life or place in the pecking order.

    I will say this not to you, but to everyone. There is no free market model that can work in health care. Any attempt will work at cross purposes with itself. The free market will by it's very nature want to insure those with the least risk for the highest profit. The target demographic competed for will be by nature, young healthy, non- child bearing age women still young enough to be healthy in general.. in other words, those least likely to need insurance. The older, the sick, the women of child bearing age will be out of luck.

    We are the only economically advanced nation in the world that does not have single payer universal health care and our cost for health care is double the next one down in cost. It works because everyone is in and lobbyists have not made a racket of it. Canada's system works fine and no, my Canadian cousins are not lining up to get "superior care" here... they are staying home and living longer.

    If this is about choice, I have a simple solution. They only need to add one more option to the marketplace to make it well. Offer people the right to buy into the Public option (Medicare). No one will be forced to take it so there can be no complaint there.. it will be a choice and a very popular one at that. Currently, it's not about consumer/patient choice, it's about pharma/insurance/industry profit.
    "They tried to bury us, but did not know we were seeds." Mexican proverb

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jan 1999
    Posts
    20,029

    Default

    Just like the beautiful Declaration of Independence was national document of intent, The Bill of Rights was needed to tweak the future needs.
    shuggie

  5. #25
    Kim Yonkee's Avatar
    Kim Yonkee is offline Ward? Don't you think you were a little bit hard on the Beaver?
    Join Date
    May 1998
    Location
    Just beyond the edge of Eureky
    Posts
    10,718

    Default

    I've never been a fan of the Affordable Care Act and I still am not, for the same entirely capitalist pigdog reason. We're talking about a government enforced market that punishes people who fail to do business with private companies, and which guarantees payment to said private companies. If the insured people don't pay Blue Cross enough, the government will.

    In the actual free market we hear so much about, a massive number of customers that are required to give you money...or else...is a value. Of sorts. That's actually one of my capitalist pig dog hot spots, "Give money to Blue across or the IRS will make you," is not even close to a "free market" scenario. But a captive customer base that's backed up by collateral, in this case, the taxpayers--that is a value that ought to provide a very strong negotiating point.

    It does not. We just had a massive rate increase and, as y'all may recall, the rationale was not, "Everybody is making more money than they did last year so, naturally, their share of the burden will go up." It was, "The insurance industry had no idea they would actually have to pay for medical care. We have to figure out how to force healthy people to pay for insurance they don't need so the insurance industry can still make money because, damn! Sick people are going to doctors! Cheaters."

    The ACA took a bite out of lots of medical providers--doctors, hospitals, equipment manufacturers. Oddly, it left the pharmaceutical and insurance industries alone...pretty much. A 25% per year insurance cost increase is the same as it ever was 15-20 years ago. The only difference is, at the moment, the government is making up the difference that we can't personally pay. I'm no Republican but this spending trajectory is unsustainable.

    I don't think we're even talking about the right things.

    For example, let's consider the insurance business model. Doing well for your stockholders is a simple matter of selling your product to people who don't need it and refusing to pay out for people who do. It's the system made famous by the Mafia. You pay protection money but, if you need help in return, some bloodless actuary breaks your kneecaps.

    Let's consider the cost of medical care. Here's a story about the cost of prostate cancer surgery, in which the number is described as somewhere between $10,000 and $135,000: https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...0609113351.htm
    It depends on the hospital. Even assuming that one is disposed to calmly price shop after a cancer diagnosis, there's no objective criteria to work with here. It's not like surgeons and anesthesiologists get star ratings on Yelp. Is there one price for a scalpel and another for a wowie, zowie nuclear approach? Do the outcomes of the $135K procedure justify the 13x price? Can a good decision be made by a terrified patient who doesn't have decades of scientific training? There is no part of this that resembles a free market populated by rational actors who operate with enlightened self-interest.

    Then there's the big American heresy: the part where we have to decide how much a life is worth. At my age, it mostly devolves to the realization that, if we're going to have some kind of national group health plan, the society that's paying for it would do best to invest in people who are half my age. If we're actually going to have national insurance, we're going to have to talk about what's reasonable at some point--a discussion I'd prefer to be led by actual doctors instead of the usual bloviating media whorish politicians--AND that discussion can't devolve into people running around, flailing their arms in the air and shrieking about "death panels."

    I'm a few years away from Medicare. The GOP ought to be able to turn it into a hedge fund, and disappear it, before I get there. I understand why people still hope that Trump will fulfill his campaign promise to protect "entitlements." Odd word, if you ask me. I've been paying into the fund for 45 years, as a person, and about 30 years, as an employer. Yes, I suppose I feel entitled to what I was promised. I don't think I'll get it.

    Putting Social Security and Medicare into the hands of Wall Street has been a Republican fantasy for decades. I don't think Wall Street will do any better with it than they did with Lehman Brothers and AIG. Nor do I think Trump will keep his campaign promise to protect "entitlements" any more than he's kept his promise to drain the swamp.

    But we can still say Obama, Obama, Obama for a while. The part where insurance still increases 20-25% per year, if you can get it, hasn't happened since... well...the last 30 years before Obama. I used to think it was possible for people to remember the very recent past; to remember, for example, that the GOP plan for "high risk pools" has been tried, and failed, multiple times. But every day is a brand new day. Dangdest thing. It's like a whole new definition of "born again."

    If I ruled the world, I'd command a discussion of how much sense it makes to support an industry designed to bet against healthcare in the first place. "You pay us; then you die," doesn't strike me as a good industry motto, no matter how honest it might be.

    Then I'd send Paul Ryan back to his job driving the Oscar Mayer Weinermobile and insist that medical policy be left up to people with medical training. Things being as they are, I guess I'll just wait for people to stop chanting, "Obama! Obama!" when they get distracted by the next shiny thing.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Sedona
    Posts
    2,301

    Default

    Everyone is making some valid points. The 2 links I provided on the previous page answer many of the questions about the ACA's failures--sabotaged by the GOP. Organizing for action put out a piece today that will help educate those that don't know me, about my sorted past. https://www.ofa.us/news/jeff-jeans-speaks-out/
    There are millions who will suffer and die with the repeal! I will continue to do all I can, in order to prevent that from happening!!!

  7. #27
    Kim Yonkee's Avatar
    Kim Yonkee is offline Ward? Don't you think you were a little bit hard on the Beaver?
    Join Date
    May 1998
    Location
    Just beyond the edge of Eureky
    Posts
    10,718

    Default

    Thanks Jeff. It's been good to see you here and on tv.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    3,573

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TerriBradt View Post
    Great, Jeff. Please let them know that my premium jumped from $268 a month in 2016 to $475 for 2017, and that I was not allowed to make more money last year than Obama allowed me to under my plan. I accidentally went over my limit, and so was penalized by paying higher taxes.
    If you got your insurance with a Medicaid subsidy in Arkansas, your financial problems stem from Republicans in Little Rock who wrote their own rules with federal approval. They worried that the more generous Democratic rules would cost THEM too much money.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    3,573

    Default

    .
    Last edited by local lurker; 03-17-2017 at 06:17 AM.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    153

    Default

    Medicaid?? If I had Medicaid, I wouldn't have this problem, would I?
    And about that 20-25% increase in premiums this year? Mine is 70%. Wonder how it will be next year for my husband, who is a year behind me to get Medicare.
    Thanks for listening, everybody. And good luck, Jeff.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •